Question great ×n translations in Portuguese (Portugal)

Hello,

I've just learned how to use the webtrees translation mechanism to solve one of my pet "peeves" with the existing Portuguese (Portugal) translation. Not to be mistaken with the one for Brazil, which is similar, but they really do use different words, like tataravó instead of tetravó for great-great-great-grandmother.

The peeve was the use of penta-, hexa-, hepta-, and octa- prefixes when we really don't use those prefixes for grandparent relations, and instead use the numeric grade: 5º, 6º, 7º and 8º (respectively).

Some sites in Portuguese that verify this to be the rule for our language:
ciberduvidas.iscte-iul.pt/consultorio/pe...tas/quinto-avo/19957
ciberduvidas.iscte-iul.pt/consultorio/perguntas/avos/3001

I didn't change the corresponding grandchildren terms, as I couldn't find any authoritative answer about that one that could justify it.

And probably the same in Brazil:  www.dicio.com.br/tataravo-ou-trisavo/

Hi João,

Have you downloaded the latest Portuguese (Portugal) translation file?

translate.webtrees.net/translate/webtrees/webtrees-21/pt/

I've started working on it several weeks ago as it was basically a Portuguese (Brazil) translation (with things like "tataravó" instead of "tetravó" as you've mentioned), and many things were not translated at all.

I actually had doubts regarding using the prefixes of the numeric grade after certain generations, and I chose the first option.

Happy to work with you - as well as with any other Portuguese folks out there - to improve the translation.

Cheers!

Actually, I hadn't yet tried to download it.. Does that mean I've been using the Brazilian Portuguese translation?

In any case, I'm free to help on achieving a better translation. I'm not sure I'll be wanting to use my tree in pt-pt, but I do want the site to be usable by family in Portugal.

One good resource I've used in this type of work was this translator manual for the pt-pt project of Drupal:  localize.drupal.org/node/664
There's quite a few terms that are very handy, even if there's a lot of Drupalisms there.

I too will help with the translation into Portuguese proper. It looks like it is already 92% complete.

Note: Deepl has probably the best online translation into proper Portuguese when it comes to phrases, a useful tool for sure.
www.deepl.com

João Machado

Using the new 2.2 version, I "got" the new translation. SO. MUCH. BETTER.

I've fixed a few issues, but I think we may have to ask the developers to tinker with the great-grandparent grades. At the moment it steps from "8º avô" to "8º bisavô". I've fixed the translation bug already, but that means that we need to step from 8º to 9º and not have a duplicate 8º. 

Update: sent an email to fisharebest

Hi @jcnventura,

Indeed.

You don't have to wait for a new webtrees release to benefit from an updated translation.

At any time you can just download the translation file (.po), move it to "<webtrees_root_folder>\resources\lang\pt\" folder and rename it to "messages.po", delete "messages.php" file and refresh any webtrees page in Portuguese language.

Cheers!

Yes, I know.. It's just that I hadn't yet bothered to download the translation file.
As I said, I'm not interested in using webtrees in any language other than English, but I am interested that my family can use the site in Portuguese, so I'll gladly help with the translations.
I did quite a lot of changes now that it was trivial to use this. "Enterros" instead of "Sepultamentos", "Óbito" instead of "Falecimento", and "Parentesco" instead of "Relação" were the main ones.. Also "Árvore de costados" where applicable.

webtrees has two systems for creating names of relationships.

The "old" system, which has 1000 translations of every possible relationship.

The "new" system, which provides each language with its own set of definitions. So far, English, French and Slovakian use the new system.

Would you want to work with me to move Portuguese to the new system?

Absolutely. Just tell me what to do.

Look at the code here:

github.com/fisharebest/webtrees/blob/8c0...States.php#L146-L253

There are two types of definition - fixed and dynamic.

Fixed rules are easy. For each relationship name, create a definition. Note that there can be several definitions for the same name. e.g. in English, "sister-in-law" can mean three different relationships. Just include the relationships that have names in your own language.

Dynamic rules are a little more complicated. These need some code, and I will probably have to help you with this. This creates things like "Third cousin twice-removed descending", or "Cousin of the 13th degree".
If you can explain the logic, I can create the code...

Maybe create an issue on github and post there?

If the "new" system brings more flexibility to relationships then I also agree and we can explain the logic.

In Portugal we don't use great grandparents as the basis on which we then apply the "grade" (e.g., x2 or 2nd). Instead, we use grandparents as the basis and then apply the grade.

For example, in the "old" system, translating "great ×%s grandparent" to Portuguese is challenging because a great x2 grandfather (great great grandfather) translates to 3rd grandparent in Portugal / Portuguese.